0:00:31 - Betsy Jordyn
So welcome to this episode of the Enough Already podcast. I'm your host, Betsy Jordyn, and we have a very special guest today. We have Suzanne Rothmeyer, who's going to be on the show, who's a photographer and she does so many great things with her clients to help them have amazing, warm, relatable images on their website. And I wanted her on the show for so many reasons. One, she's just an amazing strategist and a marketing person. She's a hugely creative photographer, but also I work a lot with my clients on their websites and we work on their copy And for a lot of times, you know, just the copy if it's not surrounded by incredible images and the main images is you, you know just, the website falls flat. So if you're looking to take your online presence to the next level, you're definitely going to want to listen into this episode. So, without further ado, welcome, suzanne.
0:01:24 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Thank you, Betsy. I'm so excited to be here and thank you so much for having me on your podcast. I'm very excited about coming on and chatting with you.
0:01:32 - Betsy Jordyn
I know it's going to be amazing because you are so great. We've had so many great conversations about your philosophies on marketing and photography. I would love to go first back in time and talk a little bit about what got you interested in photography in general, and then why do you specialize in photography for people who have websites?
0:01:51 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Okay, so I've been doing this for about 20 years, which sounds like a lot of time, a little over 20 years And I started out in doing portraits. You know, kind of like so many photographers do, you know, you start out in your garage or whatnot, or friends ask you, you start taking pictures and friends ask you that sort of thing, and it just developed and it pretty quickly became my full-time job And I really I specialized in pregnancy and senior portraits and family. You know, i did the typical thing. And then weddings and weddings became a big part of my business for a long time And I quit doing weddings a few years ago.
I actually quit doing weddings right before COVID And God, because that was a mess for the wedding industry. I kind of got out just in time And because what happened was my business was sort of it was organically going in two directions because I had these clients I'd had for years that kept coming back for their, you know, different types of portraiture And some of these and I'm going to be speaking primarily to and about women, because that's just what my niche is and it's my experience And so it's something that I relate to and I feel like I can communicate really well with, and so a lot of these women were just coming to me.
They were starting businesses or they were pivoting in their careers or they hadn't worked outside the home and were going outside the home to work and they needed some imagery of themselves And it just sort of naturally built on itself And then I had to say I started having to say no to something you know, I had to commit more to either going one direction or the other, because I one, i don't like the idea so much of trying to be everything to everybody, because I feel like it's just not a good strategy number one And I don't feel like you feel like you're doing your best work all the time either.
When you're doing that, you can't focus in.
So I went ahead and decided to not do the weddings anymore for a variety of reasons, as much as I loved doing them when I did them and just went with the branding And I loved I really I'm not going to say loved I love working with women and working with women who are, you know, stepping out of their comfort zones and you're I'm sure you deal with this so much in what you do.
As far as people pivoting either within their career or they're, they're just doing a big pivot and they're leaving maybe their corporate job or whatever and they're, they're becoming an entrepreneur And it's something that they're passionate about. Maybe they started as a hobby and it sort of grew organically for them And that just sort of took over. And then at a certain point I guess about a year and a half or two years ago I spent a long time not posting any of the branding stuff even though it, by that time, was like half my business at least And I finally decided to change up my website and just commit to that full on and really put myself out there, practice what I preach, because I don't like being in front of camera.
0:05:06 - Betsy Jordyn
That's so funny. That's like I like being behind the camera.
0:05:11 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
So I have, you know, so many women are the standards. We have these ridiculous standards for ourselves as women in our culture, and so I, of course, i'm dealing with that a lot and I'm I am no exception, and I had to go through the whole thing that I walk my clients through so that I could get on my own website. And now you see me front and center on my website. But, boy, you would not have seen that even five years ago.
0:05:35 - Betsy Jordyn
So, okay, this is a great story. So it sounds like that you've been in photography for a long time. That was your career. You were doing a lot of different things. Weddings was a big thing. Then you decided to move away from weddings. Thankfully, right before COVID, you started getting more requests from people who are transitioning And then you made that strategic decision to say, yes, i'm going in this direction And that's what it is. Did I hear that right?
0:05:58 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
0:06:00 - Betsy Jordyn
So let's talk about the importance, because you said your web, your picture is front and center on the website. So let's talk about like what, what, how have websites evolved and where are they now? and why is a warm, relatable image an absolute must for people who have a personal brand, like a consultant or coach?
0:06:20 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Great question. I love this question because, again, I'm going to kind of focus on women in particular, because women are changing the marketplace and they're changing marketing in a big, big way And they're out there checking ass, frankly. And the thing is, is that, as opposed to traditional marketing, which used to be the domain of men and that was a certain kind of template, right, And they, it was sort of a separate entity from the men themselves, right, This is the template of how you market a product or a service. And when you think about the fact that women now I think the, I think the numbers are something like women make about 70 to 80% of all purchasing decisions, Right, Yeah, So if you're going to be marketing to women because of that or because that's you know who you're marketing to, that's you know who your ideal client is, you know you, you have to, you have to think about how to market to women, because it's very different. Women want to feel a connection, whether they're conscious of it or not. They put a very high priority on feeling a connection with somebody before they decide if they want to do business with them or not. So that changes the whole game, right? And so, all of a sudden, you're also kind of seeing this shift of where the person is the product. It doesn't matter anymore what they're selling, what service they're selling, what product they're selling, because ultimately it's the connection with that person that's going to make the, the buying decision on the other end.
So that's why having because you can you can take those images and use them. Yes, you can, obviously. You know, when I'm branding, I have a whole process I go through with clients and so that it's reflecting their specific needs with, with their products and services. But you also have to pull back from that a little bit and and think about the fact that a person's personality and values don't typically change a lot, right, And so if you start tapping into that and you have imagery that reflects that, you can, you can apply that imagery.
It's very flexible, you know, and you can apply it to a lot of different things. And it's all about being prepared, because when you start talking about people pivoting which you deal with a lot, pivoting successfully a big, big part of that is being prepared. And the biggest mistake I see is people not being prepared for it, because they're not thinking of themselves as the commodity. They're waiting for some opportunity and then they're going to gear it to that opportunity instead of really being prepared with at least a basic level of imagery that they can, they have at the ready so that when an opportunity comes up, they've got something.
0:09:26 - Betsy Jordyn
I definitely want to pursue that one in just a second. I want to hit on something that you said. In the first place, though, is that the marketing has changed in some ways because women are taking over a lot of the buying decisions, so could you describe a little bit about like, what a website might have been like, maybe even 10 years ago to now, and why is the photography such a key element of that website? You mentioned there's that connection, but what was it like before? like, because I imagine somebody's listening, and then they're like well, i'm a consultant, i work with organizations. They're not developing a relationship with me, they're developing a relationship with my methodology, and I need to look credible. So wouldn't stock photos of people in the boardroom be more compelling than a picture of me on my website? You, can you speak to that?
0:10:12 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Yes, yes, so you're absolutely right. That that is what. And still, a lot of websites. I still go to a lot of websites and I'm just, you know, cringing because people are relying, because they don't want to get in front of the camera, so they're using these other, these stock photography, you know images and things like that, because that's their idea of looking professional. That that's a, that's a hangover from an older, obsolete way of marketing, and what used to be perceived as professional has changed.
And it's not to say that because, once again, you're dealing more with women making these decisions. Women have more power than they've ever had, they have more money than they've ever ever had, and they're making these decisions, and they're making them unilaterally a lot of times. So you then, once again, it comes back to how is that woman going to be making that decision? And if I see something, that's just a template, that, and there's nothing wrong with templates and there's nothing wrong with stock photos, okay, i mean, there's a, there's a time and a place for them. I mean, i have a template, you know, for my website, but I have absolutely built it also from the guy. I've changed everything from the template, you know, i to work for me. So again, it's having that connection point. And if they're all they're seeing, are these just abstract images that they see on every other?
some version of on every other website, what's distinguishing you? because that's not ultimately, they want to know that you're credible, but we'll get into that too as far as presenting yourself. But they, they need to feel like they have some idea of who you are as a person, because that's how we, personally, that's how we approach you know, do I trust this person? I think you have. like, you only have a matter of seconds in person, even where somebody we don't even realize we're doing it, but we've assessed you know in a matter of seconds, when we meet a person, their education, their competence, their confidence, their all of that.
And it's gotten worse I don't want to say worse, but you know that time has condensed even more with the internet and with social media. So you know, when you talk about a website, you've got like less than a second to make an impression, And if all you've got on there is the same or another version of what somebody else has because that's what their idea of looking professional is then they're you're just going to be skimmed over.
0:12:52 - Betsy Jordyn
So somebody might be listening in as a hook. Thank goodness I don't. My clients are men, they're all in corporate, their senior executives So few I'm off the hook, you know. Is it just women who need that connection? or ultimately, a man who's hiring somebody for a consulting job, for a coaching job, wants to make that emotional connection, even if it's not top of mind for them.
0:13:19 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Yes, I think it's. It's not, as it comes, in a different order I think, for men. But men are very visual, We all know that. So it's not like you can't just take that off the table for men. It's just that I think they're maybe looking for something a little bit different, but it's still the presence of the person and being able, because if you're behind a screen you know it's all guesswork and they want to, and of course people can say on that well, what if they, you know they have a bias one way or the other?
I don't want them to see that there's only so much. I can speak to that because, again, I my focus is more on on women and how they make decisions. But that's not to say that you know my a lot of my women, female clients, that they they also have male clients. It's not like all of my my clients have female clients. But you're, you can convey the professionalism in a lot of different ways, But I think that the norm now is so much the person being in the forefront that even men kind of have a certain expectation of that, and if it's not there, then you're almost not doing your job as a person, either a wanting to get hired, or you know, with a corporation or be wanting to get hired as an entrepreneur, because it's, it's myth. It's just missing a key element that is now becoming more of the standard.
And if you're not, you're just, you're kind of lagging behind and again you're kind of obsolete in your approach.
0:15:03 - Betsy Jordyn
When I look at websites, the first thing I do is I look for the person, especially if it's like oh, i'm hiring an individual for something And I think clients would do the same thing. So the way I explained it to my clients because I always advocate, like you need a lot of warm, relatable images for your website and the way I describe it and you could say if I you correct me or or elaborate away.
I say is it's about your client, because somebody's like I don't want to have that, i don't want to have a picture of myself. You know I want my work to speak for itself, like, but the reality is is you are the product, you're the ones that it's like going to buy an iPhone and then you have to like, look for, like well, where's the iPhone? you have to like, look for it. Similarly, you want to have the iPhone front and center. If you're going to go to an Apple website, you know you want to be able to have you front and center And it's also that limbic connection that builds that warm, trusting relationship.
Which is why I distinguish between warm, relatable images versus professional images, like images that invite somebody versus the. You know, like that third person, like none of the copy I help my clients with is ever in that third person. Like you know, Betsy Jordyn has a master's degree from Rollins College and she has all these years of experience like I never talk about that. So you tell your story. You know you can bring up your credentials in a nice way. Similarly, i think you know power pictures like that are like too stuffy with a suit when nobody wears like ties anymore. So how would you distinguish between the important word? how would you, how would you describe why warm relatable images are really important and what's the difference between a warmer relatable image and the other kinds of images that that people might think are the more professional images?
0:16:43 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Again, i think we're talking about sort of an old idea of what's professional. So that used to be the idea. That's the idea we always had about professional. Like you're saying, the cross d'harmes, it's like power poses, right and again that's that tends to be a more masculine definition of it and that is definitely changing. And when you have warm, relatable images, the professionalism is going to come across in the, the professional look of the photo itself And of all the elements that went into that photo, and that's everything from location to color palette to wardrobe to, you know, styling, hair and makeup. All of that builds each one builds on on the other and that creates a very professional looking image. But within that image you can be totally warm and relatable, you know you don't have to be wearing a suit and you don't have to be crossing the line. You can still be warm and relatable and have a power pose of sorts, you know. So those rules can all be sort of mixed as long as you have that framework.
And the importance is is that you know there's there's different things involved, like repetition. The more people see you, you put yourself out there more and more images of yourself out there more and more. Then it kind of goes through this flow of that that they feel that connection number one right, and then the repetition builds familiarity, so you become familiar to them, and when you become familiar to them they start to unconsciously trust you more. And that trust then leads to relationship. And I think that we're way more geared to doing business as a relationship now than we ever have been, and that's sort of this trickle effect that's happening When you start putting yourself out there as the product.
0:18:35 - Betsy Jordyn
Ultimately I like what you're talking about here around that building that trust, because if you think about the kind of work so the people who listen in on the show, our consultants and coaches And I think we underestimate the significance of the work that we're doing is that, ultimately, when, as a consultant or coach, we're asking somebody to open themselves up and be vulnerable, like, let me show you them all the dirty laundry in my organization, let me show you all the dirty laundry, and like how I'm managing my finances or how I'm handling my relationships, or something along those lines, and it seems like when, what? what you're talking about is the photography and having images of you in a variety of different ways subconsciously gets that person to say, okay, this is a safe person, or I can share my organizational challenges or my weaknesses as a leader, or my areas of opportunity when it comes to developing my business and that kind of thing, that it gives that comfort to that client that you're somebody I can be open with. Is that?
0:19:33 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
accurate, yes, yes And they. they have confidence then in, in you, and doing business with you.
You know, when you, when you have a, when you've put thought and intention into your imagery, it speaks to the client in a way that I mean I'm sure you would agree with me. you know, if I go through and I just see that you know they put on their piled sweater and they're a cluttered background and you know, have not, it's, it's not intentional, it's not purposeful, it's, it's not necessarily even you know an image that's telling a story about what you want to convey to the client. All of those things one again, all of those things build on each other and I just look at it and I think to myself that's a person who isn't even willing to invest in themselves. That's professional. So why?
0:20:27 - Betsy Jordyn
would I. That's such a great point. So you say that again is can you say that?
0:20:37 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
whole core again is like if they're not willing to invest, can you say that again? If they're not willing, if I see that they're not willing to invest in themselves, in their own business, why would I invest in them? You?
know, I, i want to gain confidence when I look at their website, when I look at their blog, when I, you know, i want to see that they have, they have a lot and intention into everything, because they take it seriously. Because if I don't see that, then I just see. you know, there's how. you know, i shoot coaches a lot And I still go and see websites where there's no, there's no image of the person And it's like just what you said you're actually dealing in a very intimate space as a coach, even as a business, whether you're a business coach or life coach or some combination of the two, because I don't think you can totally separate them anymore.
0:21:30 - Betsy Jordyn
As an organizational consultant, i would say that that's even more intimate If you think about an executive who brings you in and allows you to do an assessment, talk to your people, do a 360 on you, like that is so, so vulnerable. You know, like, and the board might know about what you're doing And you know there's a lot of exposure there. You know that's where I think sometimes executives power up when you're going through the proposal process. But I think you could disarm them. I like what you're saying here about the website on the whole because I talk a lot about it from a copy standpoint is I tell people all the time like you don't build your credibility through your credentials, you build it through the empathy You know, the more that you can tell someone like hey, you're struggling with this and I can get inside their head. So that's why the brand building stuff that I do with my clients, one-on-one, is so important, is we got to get into the client's head and understand the world from their perspective. So that's one part of the website. The other part of the website is the visual branding that starts to create the color palette and all those kinds of things, and then it seems like there's the other element that you mentioned, which we've been talking about. The subject of our conversation is that, those high quality images.
But I think what you're saying underneath the whole thing is this whole strategic intention behind it. You know that I have taken the time I thought it through. I thought through what images I want. I thought through my copy. I thought through my visitor journey on my website. I thought about all of the copy and all of these decisions and all of them subconsciously conveys to a client.
I have invested in myself. I take myself seriously, so you can put your trust in me And the people who don't put the effort where it's like all right, i'm just going to get a website out for a weekend. I'm just going to get some sort of like you know, squarespace template nothing wrong with Squarespace or something, just like something I could do myself. I'm not going to think through you know who my ideal client is and the value that I offer. I'm not going to really work hard to create that second person engaging, compelling copy And I'm absolutely just going to use stock folder photos and ignore the whole thing. I'm communicating to a client that I don't take myself all that seriously And you shouldn't take me all that seriously either.
0:23:46 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Right, and then I'm not accessible. You know that's the other thing. You know, if you post, you know I tell people, i tell clients who have not, you know, are not used to posting pictures of themselves, i say go, go, post a picture of yourself, i don't care, don't even. You know, i don't even care if you put a ton of thought into it. It doesn't need to be contrived, but do it and just see what kind of response you get. And they do it in every single time. They get way more. Not that life is all about or business is all about likes and stuff, but still it's just an exercise to go through And invariably it has the most likes, more than some some other image they put on that. They put all this, you know, thought into And the reason is is because people want to see behind the screen. You know it's like pulling the curtain back a little bit.
And that's how they're going to feel like you're relatable enough for them to be vulnerable with you. And they're doing it in a professional way Because you know, when people talk, i think authenticity gets a little over overused, but you know, vulnerable I would. You know I love Bernay Brown. Authenticity and vulnerability are very closely related, right? So you know, it's just an important thing to remember that people are going to respond to that response, to seeing your face, to you as a person in the context of your business. It's just, it's more and more and more important, and the I always I like to think of myself, as you know, when I'm creating imagery. What I'm trying to do for the client is I'm trying to create a bridge between their client and them visually that tells their story whether it be their, their services, their process, they're all of it And a bridge that's easy for that client to walk across and feel like they, you're the person they want to do business with.
0:25:42 - Betsy Jordyn
Oh, i'd like to unpack the authenticity and vulnerability, if that's okay with you, because I think that's a really important concept, because I think getting in front of the camera, you know, is a vulnerable experience, but vulnerabilities different than authenticity, yes, so let's talk about, because, to me, like, let me, let me throw out a definition and you could add, change and delete to what I'm talking about as it relates to photography, i think authenticity is is that I will use images that look and feel like me, that they are organic and they relate to exactly who I am. So, for example, when I first started my business, i originally I had like a kind of a casual, like green shirt, a button down, and you know I felt okay with that one. I got all this feedback. Like you know, you got to be in a suit, you got to be in a suit, you got to be in a suit, so I took a, so I had a photo shoot. Like I don't like suits. I feel like suits were like a straight jacket for me. But you know, everybody said, because you know you could stand up in front of a group of executives and command the room and blah, blah, blah, and so I did that and it's like I hated, it's like I feel like every time I looked at the picture, like it's like I felt like you know that whole thing. And with my last photo shoot I did like, right before I did my last photo shoot, which is like about a year or so ago, i literally went through my closet and I dumped every single suit and I said I'm never again wearing a suit ever I will, i.
And so I got myself a wrap dress And you know, and I put that. You know that's what I chose, because you know, and I had other other more feminine looking clothes because that's the way I am like. I didn't want to dress like that. So that's authenticity. It's like the picture look and feel like me.
The vulnerability thing you know, i use the definition of vulnerability is I talk about. It's like the word abilities at the end, so it's an ability to be wounded. That means that I have gotten some crap for my wrap dress that is out there. I had to be vulnerable in front of, i had to be vulnerable just to get in front of the camera, but I did get crap for it. And I have other clients who get crap, if you know, because if you show a little cleavage or you know, like you know, or whatever you know, you might get crap for it And you have to learn to live with that and you have to overcome like that anxiety. That's the way I would differentiate the two. Would you agree with that? Yes, would you add to that?
0:27:50 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
I would agree with that and I would add to that I think we misunderstand what the term means as far as authenticity, and I think too often people think that, well, if I'm going to be authentic, i'm going to, you know, just be me and I'm not going to prepare or, you know, be thoughtful and intentional about what I'm wearing or any of that, and it's like, you know, nobody needs to see us when we roll out of bed and that's our most authentic right.
Right, it's like let's. I think we have to kind of think about that term in the context of branding and our businesses. And you, i love that you ditched the suits, i love that, and I am sure that no matter what you do, you're going to get flack. But, of course, people, we gravitate always to the familiar and that business suit thing is still in our minds because it takes a long time to shed those ideas generations, you know and that's still our idea of professional and power and all of that. And the great thing is is women are redefining that and you, ditching the suits and wearing your wrap dress is redefining that.
0:28:58 - Betsy Jordyn
So how would you thank you? I appreciate that And it felt very empowering Like I got it. you know I went and sent all my suits the threat up so I got a little bit of money for it, but it's like putting it in the bag and sending it off. It's like ooh, get. you know, like I'm recondoed, my my professional image and say this no longer serves me. This does not bring me joy out, and so it kind of gave space for other things. So I work with a lot of clients who are transitioning from corporate into their consulting or coaching business. How would you advise that person around, like how do they pick out the right wardrobe? that relates to this phase of their career, or what this business is all about. What? what do you do with your clients to help them think through, like, how do I get ready for this, for the shoot for men and for women?
0:29:45 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Okay, so I the first thing I do with clients after a little discovery call to make sure we're a good fit and for me to get to know them a little and them to get to know me and how I work a little, is I send them off a really comprehensive questionnaire And I think it's like I don't know 20 pages.
I mean it's a comprehensive questionnaire and it covers all all the different aspects And it's just a way for me to mine information And all the time I have clients come back after filling it out and saying this was such a great exercise. There were questions I never would have thought of And now these questions are really getting me thinking about whatever it is And they saw a lot of times they wind up sort of shifting what they were going to do because of that, because it's it's all about. You know, like when you say you shed the suits, it's it's almost like you're you're getting rid of a weight and you're you're lifted and you're you're more authentic than because you've gotten rid of this thing. That's sort of attached to you. That's not really part of who you are And whatever your style is or maybe you don't know what your style is you know, if we go through all kinds of transitions in life men and women both And if we're changing careers, that adds to it as far as how we do or don't dress. In that, in that context And having a style, i always recommend, if it's in the budget, to hire a stylist.
I mean I style a lot of my clients. But I also really recommend hiring a stylist because it's, once again, it's just another aspect of investing in yourself as the product, because it's not a one time thing. If you invest in a good stylist, you you then have that. They've taught you to fish, you know. You know our friend militia talks about that, you know teaching her clients to fish. Melissa militia marks, who's a fantastic stylist in the Seattle area.
You can go to rent the runway. You can go here in Seattle there's our more where you can rent And they've got a stylist on site. So you can start. But you have to be intentional about you, have to actually think about you know who am I and what is the business that I'm in or going to be in, and not try to affect some kind of personality for that, but to just be who you are, but be the best version of that and have somebody help you choose clothing and colors and and all of that that convey that. Because once we're all, we're telling a story. We're telling a story with what we put on our bodies. We're telling a story with what we, we, we show on our websites and our social feeds. It's And you want to be telling the positive story.
You know, we all have enough negative stories and that get in the way of putting ourselves out there in the first place. But when you have somebody, i think it's very helpful to have somebody who's a professional help you through those things, because then you have it for the rest of your life, it's not just a one-on.
0:32:48 - Betsy Jordyn
So I think what I'm getting from what you're saying is like okay, so I help my clients with figuring out their brand messaging and where they fit into the marketplace and what they're all about, and figure out their gifts and all of that It seems like. Then, when you get to the website and the photography, it's like that whole process just continues. It's like you're telling your story through your copy and then you're telling your story through your image, and your clothing is all part of that whole story. And if you're transitioning in some type of way, like if you're transitioning from your corporate leadership kind of career into, like a coaching business, then let your wardrobe tell that story as well and let yourself lean into this new, idealized version of who you're becoming. So take pictures of. I love this. So it's about get pictures of who you're becoming, not pictures of who you used to be.
0:33:43 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
You've been right, right And you have to have that vision first, which is what you're doing with your clients. You're helping them hone that vision and clarify that vision And then, once they've done that, then I can look at that, all of that, and then I can craft imagery that reflects that and tells that story to the client.
0:34:03 - Betsy Jordyn
So it's not just like don't do photos just because you needed it'll help your website convert. I'm sure that you could share statistics around how warm, relatable images impact conversion rates. Actually, i'm gonna make sure you tell me that statistic if you have it. But it's not just about that. It's really about it's just another way for you to lean into your value proposition and the person that you're becoming and what you're trying to offer. And it's just another action learning opportunity.
So get the pictures and then embrace the process at the same time, because this is a critical element of bringing your business to life and telling that story. So the authenticity here is. So the tips that we would say here is one, be really mindful of what you're trying to convey and what your story is. Two, if needed, hire a highly qualified stylist who could help you pick out the right outfits for your shoot that you could have those outfits moving forward. And three, just be really intentional about what you're doing. Put the intention behind it of saying this is a way for me to step into my power, into this new value proposition, this new thing that I'm creating, and that's gonna be what will help me become more authentic with my pictures and pick the right outfits and the right colors. All of that will go.
0:35:31 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Right, is that? Yes, and there's a feedback loop that happens with all of that. So it's been proven over and over that preparation and confidence are inherently linked. The more prepared you are across the board I don't care what we're talking about the more prepared you are, the more confident you are, and so, being part of the process they go through with you, the process they go through with me, all of that brings them into. they're part of that process, they're invested in it personally. By the time they get in front of the camera. We've covered we've had so many conversations and we've covered so many things. We have multiple mood boards. They're excited. Their nervousness has now turned, shifted, way more to excitement because they're so invested in it and they actually know what we're doing and why we're doing it, and they have the shot list and they know exactly what we're doing, when we're doing it, what we're doing it with, where we're doing it, and then that takes off. All of that Because, of course, way too often, that preparation is either haphazard, non-existent or not really well thought out, and so, of course, you're gonna feel insecure and uncertain when you step in front of a camera when there's no plan and you haven't even been really part of the process.
Right, you don't even know what the intention is behind it, but by that time they know exactly. You know, and then it frees them up. It's like ditching the suits you know They're not questioning, they're not wondering, they're not, the energy isn't going into all of those places. They're actually excited about it and they're invested in it. And then the feedback loop comes and they see those images and they see themselves and they see themselves, genuinely themselves, but they see themselves in another light which, getting back to you, saying the person that they are becoming, and that creates a feedback loop. Then, and then the more repetition you have with that, the more they see themselves, and whether they put their images out there on their different platforms, that they get that feedback again. And of course, it's all mostly unconscious, but it's, you know, there's no denying it, there's. You know there's also the mirror effect with your clients. You know, whatever you put out to somebody else, they automatically tend to reflect back, which is an important thing to remember.
0:37:54 - Betsy Jordyn
So my husband is working, we're working with my husband on his website, so it's taken him forever. So we got pictures about a year ago or so, maybe even almost two years ago, for his website And he really didn't have a vision for what we were doing. I kind of had a vision for what we were doing but he didn't. So we had these really great pictures. He just got the homepage from my team who designed his website And this is like a left brain super Uber left brain finance guy.
I thought he was gonna cry like right then and there, like just seeing the pictures in the context of the website and his value proposition, and he's like he's been sending different clients, like the website, and he's like it's totally transformed his understanding of his value proposition, like talk about the mirror effect, like he sees through this whole thing, like what his value is, and he's like I'm ready to go Like his conversation is changing with even how he's landing clients because of what he was able to reflect, because he saw himself in those images surrounded by the words, surrounded by all that other stuff, and it's changed things. So I think what you're saying is accurate. It's around the preparation, but then the mirroring the first mirroring to yourself and believing in it. And I think his vulnerability around marketing because he's, you know, he's gotten most of his business, like most of my clients have It's that he began, you know, just sort of like word of mouth kind of thing, and now he's gonna actually start a YouTube channel and other things to get clients And so he's been overcoming the vulnerability. So that's where the next part, where I would wanna go to, is okay, so this is so we wanna get authenticity.
But it's like how do you deal with the vulnerability of that initial first part of getting in front of the camera, you know, and the vulnerability of, you know, putting your images out there? you know that may or may not get well received. And then how do you deal with some of my clients, like we're mid-career, you know. So there's extra vulnerability that comes with. You know I'm not in that 20, 30 year old. You know social media phenomenon, you know generation. How do you help somebody who's a little bit older feel?
0:40:06 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
comfortable in front of the camera Like me aging online.
it's so fun Yeah especially like to say if you didn't grow up with it, and I think that those are such great questions and I'm not sure which order to go in, so if I forget one, let me know as I go along. But to start with your first question, i'm gonna go back again to you know. First is the mindset and a big part of the mindset of getting someone to pass that hurdle, to come in for their first session, is them really understanding the importance of it and them understanding that they are their business and that they as a person is going to be most of the time because very few people are offering something that nobody else is offering right. So ultimately, you know you as a person and how you convey things to your clients is going to be the deciding or one of the big deciding factors, you know, for your client. So understanding the importance of it is the first step and a lot of people really don't understand it. And then, when you walk them through that and then they start to visualize what that looks like and how that relates to their bottom line and their business is success, then you know you get their attention on that too. And then again, preparation. I think preparation.
I have found that going through the process of preparation is the biggest factor, aside from mindset, where you know for them to overcome that, because once again, by the time we've gone through all of those things, they're so excited and their intention behind it, their passion behind what they're doing, the reason they're doing it in the first place, just starts to override more and more their own personal thing, because you have to kind of get out of your body a little bit with it right And be focused more on the intentionality of what you're doing, the reason why you're doing it, and then again that starts to go get into a feedback loop. So then they're excited, they're busy doing the things for the shoot. I'm constantly walking them, talking them through it, so they're not, you know, having to sit there in the static pose. I mean, we're just constantly moving. I'm talking to them And it's a conversation. At that point They already have no me, you know, because we've had conversations and that's again I'm going to go back to.
That's one of the biggest things that people do where they wait too late. They wait until they need something and then they're in a panic. They want to schedule a shoot for next week And I can't service them at the level I want to service them And they're not. They're not going to get the results that they actually need And they don't even know that a lot of times that they need or want it, they just think that, oh, i'll just grab a few things out of my closet And so you have to just walk them. Before that, you have to walk them through all of those things and the importance of all of those things so that they see the value in it for themselves and their business. Okay, and then getting to people who are mid career aging. You know there's so many reasons like I don't want to do it because I gained weight. I'm, you know, i'm aging, i don't like how I look anymore. And I look at these things.
0:43:33 - Betsy Jordyn
Yeah, can you do something? Can you do something with this?
0:43:39 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Yeah, i always feel like I should have a checklist because I get that so much and it breaks my heart, you know, a little bit each time, because men never say that stuff to me.
0:43:50 - Betsy Jordyn
0:43:51 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Oh, but they worry about other things.
0:43:53 - Betsy Jordyn
Like you know, like they're, you know the gut thing and you know, let's see.
0:43:59 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Not so much, you know. I just it floors me and I, you know, again, i've been doing this for years and it just it is a little heartbreaking but but I've had to get over it. And again, repetition is gold, you know. And you know, go get a Mel Robbins book. You know, read some Mel Robbins. You know you can make fun of these things about, you know high fiving yourself in the mirror or the Wonder Woman power pose. But there's no denying they have an effect. They have a psychological effect and physiologically things change in your body. I'm good enough.
0:44:37 - Betsy Jordyn
I'm good looking enough. I'm gosh, darn it. My future clients will like me. I'm good enough. Come on, let's all say it together. I'm good enough. I'm good looking enough. I'm like gosh, darn it. My future clients will like me. I'm like it's Suzanne instead of Stuart Smalley, it'll be Suzanne.
0:45:06 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
And in front of that mirror, naked and high five yourself. So if you don't feel better, you know it's like exposing yourself. You know, not literally, but and repetition No, not exposing yourself.
0:45:16 - Betsy Jordyn
So we do not recommend for professional images that you expose yourself. Let's not do that. That would be a different photographer. That's not us. It's a different brand.
0:45:31 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Just throw that in there and see if anyone notices.
0:45:36 - Betsy Jordyn
Oopsies, okay, so. So let's recap all the things that we talked about today that it seems like how can someone boost their online presence worth of warm, relatable images? It seems like thing one is being clear about the role and purpose of professional images and why professional images, and especially warm, relatable images, relate to your conversions and your success and what. How marketing has evolved to be more feminine maybe not just male, female, but more feminine oriented where relationships are key. And also for my clients who are listening, consulting and coaching. We think that we're selling methodology, but people are really opening themselves up to us and we have to respect the vulnerability in our warm, relatable images will not only help with us getting clients. It will help us be more effective with our clients because our clients will trust us quicker, which is what we need in order to do our jobs. So let's get clear. That's thing. One thing to it seems like it's also get clear on you know, who am I becoming and what am I all about? you know to be really intentional about, like my strategy, what I'm trying to create with my business, who I want to reflect into the image of, what I want to reflect into the world, be really intentional about my wardrobe choices. If needed, get a stylist and be really thoughtful around that.
It seems like the third thing, though, that I think fits into this whole mix, but we didn't really talk about it, is for sure to get a photographer who gets what you're going through and gets what you need for your website. So it's not enough just to get some sort of photographer who does portraits. You don't want the real estate headshot type of person. You want someone who gets it because you know what you're talking about. You know when you get with your clients, you know you're talking to them, you're keeping them relaxed. I'm sure you teach them how to do the, you know the poses and all of that and how to stand. So you need the right photographer who gets the kind of images that you need for your work. So that seems like the third, and then the fourth would be is you know, with all that preparation, just relax, have fun? But there's that part. So how do what was just somebody? is that like kind of big picture, like what we talked about today, or is there a step that I missed?
0:47:54 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
No, and that I would definitely, you know, ping pretty hard on the get a branding photographer, somebody who specializes in that and is not trying to be everything to everybody because it is its own animal branding photography, because you are shooting specifically for different platforms and you need to understand how to shoot for those different, what the needs are for those platforms, and they can be everything from technical to, you know, aesthetic and visual And, and yeah, the six things that you know also help with the self confidence getting in front of the camera. I have my little list that because somebody who really understands lighting and posing you can take, you can either add 20 pounds or subtract 20 pounds, just with lighting and posing, okay, and so you want somebody who really understands that. They understand what branding photography is and what the needs of it are for the client, because a lot of times the client doesn't know.
0:48:49 - Betsy Jordyn
They wouldn't know. why would they know that's not their area?
0:48:53 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
In the web designer, in the into the conversation, or their and their copywriter, if they have them yet.
0:49:00 - Betsy Jordyn
Oh, that's important, Okay, so let's dive into this one. So, if we have the meta big picture of what we talked about today, let's let's really zero in on what would. What are the criteria that somebody should be looking for in a brand photographer? because you just mentioned a couple things. One they know how to understand. They understand the different platforms. That seems like that's key, that you have to understand, like you need to have, like, in the thirds, you know, for a hero shot and they know that. They know what kind of future marketing that you would need. You know your personality shots, your, you know all those shots. You need somebody who's going to have that. You want somebody who also is willing to collaborate with the rest of your team, you know, with your copywriter, with your web designer. You know those are. Those are a couple things. What else? somebody who's friendly, who can make you at ease. That seems to be another criteria. Like, what are some of the other criteria?
0:49:58 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
this that somebody should be looking for Yeah, i think, when you're, when you're surfing around and you put, you know, i would say Google brand photographer in your area and and look and see it. Because if you just go to photography, if their feed is filled with like, oh, they've got some weddings in there, they've got some family pictures in there, they've got, and it's not to say, i mean, i still do, i still do some of those things, but you're not going to, you have to dig on my website to find them. And I would have to, you know, basically give you a link specifically for that, because I have a lot of clients I've had for years that I still love doing that for. But but they're their whole feed on their website, on. It should all be geared to branding.
And yeah, and look and see, you know what resources do they have what?
because if there's so many things that the client doesn't even, like I said, understand as far as what the clients are, and a lot of times they're putting the cart before the horse they don't know what order to do things in.
You know, when you talk about what you do with a client, it's brilliant for me when I have a client who's already done a version of that Right, because then they come to me with way more clarity, because a lot of times I walk my clients through to just to even get them, you know, clear on what they're doing and what their work is. So it's super helpful for me if they come into it with that And then other times it's like they haven't put any thought into their, their website. They know they have to have a website, but they want to do the photo shoot before they've even put any thought into what the website and so it's all of those things and understanding you know which is what order they need to go in to be most efficient and effective and get you the results that you, that you want and you need. So, okay, did I go off on a tangent?
0:51:52 - Betsy Jordyn
No, no, no. This is great. So let's clarify now, like here's the big picture of how do you boost your online image. So I'm going to update from what I just said a second ago. So step one is you need to work with somebody like me who can help you with your brand clarity, what your business is all about. How are you going to stand out and get that promise nailed and understand your ideal client. Then you need to work on your website strategy on the whole, like get big picture. Like what, how's your website going to fit into? how's the website going to finish your Yeah, yeah, oh, what's your color?
0:52:25 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
You know, because this, because I'm choosing locations, you know I'm scouting locations for each client and that the location in the images needs to match their, their, brand aesthetic.
0:52:38 - Betsy Jordyn
All right, we're gonna have to pause real quick because my phone had just rung and I don't know if it cut that part out. So wait a minute, can I be here? Is that me? Yeah, something to happen with my phone, okay, so all right, so let's back up.
So what I'm hearing you say is this is the order that we need to focus on to help our clients get warm, relatable images and stuff when they need to work with someone like me who can help them clarify what their business is all about, their brand, what it's all about. Second, then, we need to work through the overall website strategy and the brand aesthetic What's the vibe, what's the feeling and what are you trying to do and get that strategy done so that, when they get to someone like you, there's clarity on what that's all about. Then, three is make sure you go then look for a photographer who is a brand photographer and somebody who's very specific, who can help you from a overall online platform kind of standpoint and helping you with your business, and who can give you that comfort that you need, you know. Step four is then, with that particular photographer, really working through with your visual branding and all the things that you wanna do choose your wardrobe and plan your shoot and work through any of your mindset challenges that would keep you from being ready and available during that day to get those amazing photos Between the strategy and the shopping and the potential stylist that you might get to make sure you have great wardrobe then you gotta keep working on your mindset.
You know I'm good enough, i'm smart enough, i'm good looking enough. My clients will love me. Get that down so that you could show up to the shoot and just be in the hands of your photographer. You don't have to have it all figured out. Let the photographer lead you. If you have a really good shot list, let the photographer lead you and then, when you're done, then you could look at all the images that you have and then decide from there. That seems to be the path to how to make the most out of your photography session and get those images that you need to create the conversions, the trust and actually create the client impact, because the images help accelerate the trust building with your clients.
0:54:48 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
0:54:50 - Betsy Jordyn
Is that what we've been talking about? Yes, awesome. Okay, so if someone wants to work with you, i know, obviously if they're in the Seattle area, they could easily work with you. How can they find? how do people find you? and do you work with people who are not in the Seattle area as well, and how does that work?
0:55:08 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
Yes, absolutely. I'll work with people anywhere, In fact in a couple of weeks, while I'm taking a little vacation first, but I'm shooting in Israel and Jordyn for a little boutique tour company. So I'll be doing that for two weeks right after my vacation time. So I'm gonna be gone for a month, but yeah.
0:55:25 - Betsy Jordyn
Do you need any assistance? I know, I'll volunteer. I don't always wanna go to Israel. That's on my bucket list. I know me too.
0:55:33 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
I'm very excited. Actually It was kind of funny how it came about, but and yeah, obviously Seattle is very easy. So just reaching out to me through my website, which is wwwSusanneRothmeyercom It's a little bit of a long name, but you just plug me in and I'll come up as a brand photographer in the Seattle area, and then just punch one of the buttons that says discovery call And there's no obligation. I would never I get the clients that I'm meant to get and it's all about just having a chat, because a lot of people they'll call me and they're not even sure if they're ready to make the step or not, but they're just kind of looking for information. And yeah, and we chat and figure out what you're trying to do, and then I might. There's times where I say, well, i think that you need to do this, this or this first, and then come back to me when you've done that and you'll be ready to plan a shoot. So yeah, i'm very friendly, i'm very accessible.
0:56:33 - Betsy Jordyn
Well, obviously, like you know and you're so great at just so many different things that goes far and beyond just a typical photographer or even a brand photographer, like all the things that you talked about is like making somebody comfortable. that makes or breaks things, because your pose, if you're uncomfortable in the pose and you don't have a photographer who could help you relax into the pose, it's not gonna work out. And I know you're the person who could help them be comfortable, especially for women who are the mid-career who really wants to have their look great and not feel bad about like aging and that kind of thing. Like you're the person as well, i would highly recommend you for anybody. I've seen your pictures. we have partnered together, so I absolutely would recommend you for sure, and I'm very picky about photography, as you would imagine. Well, i'm picky about everything because I'm picky or intentional. whichever way you want.
0:57:25 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
I know I love that about you though I wouldn't use picky. I think you're just very intentional and you like to be very clear about, and that's an amazing, amazing quality.
0:57:36 - Betsy Jordyn
Well, thank you. Is there anything that you would wanna tell me about visual branding, boosting your online image with photography, or anything about websites, building a business, entrepreneurship, and I'm just not asking you the right question.
0:57:52 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
No, no, i think my big message more and more to women who are again in any of those categories where they're pivoting or they're starting a new business or a midlife switch, any of those things. I just wanna really drive home the point that if you are transitioning, if you're leaving corporate, if you are in a midlife pivot, you're going off to be an entrepreneur. You're aging, you've gained weight. I don't care what's going on with you, whether you're a man or a woman or however you identify. The principle is the same that you are the business. It doesn't matter what it is you're doing in that business. It can be service, it can be a product, it can be you.
The switch to treating yourself as the business and investing in yourself as that business is gonna pay off for you in a big, big way, because, again, the way that we're marketing is changing and you can. Then, if you invest in that, you take that seriously, that's gonna go with you, that's gonna go such a long way. It's not a one off. You do it, you take it seriously, you invest in yourself and then that's gonna. You can take that anywhere and apply it to anything that you're doing.
And the other thing I love about it too, is being prepared and investing in yourself in that way. Allows for I had a fabulous business coach a while back and she said something about she would refer to the wild card always allow for the wild card. And I love that because you might get hyper focused that you're gonna do this thing, you're gonna switch and do this thing, but some other opportunity might come along that you never expected. And if you're prepared preparation is such an important thing to being able to say yes to an opportunity, because you don't always have a lot of time to say yes or no to it, right, and if you're prepared, you can say yes to something that comes along that you never maybe would have imagined. That was even better than what you had planned.
1:00:02 - Betsy Jordyn
I love that. So, basically, ultimately, at the end of the day, if you wanna overcome any confidence issues, definitely get clear on why you're doing it and prepare in advance. Understand that when you invest in you, your clients are gonna invest in you. You go first and the more you invest in yourself, the more the clients will invest in you and there's a correlation between those.
1:00:23 - Suzanne Rothmeyer
1:00:25 - Betsy Jordyn
Thank you so much for being on the show. This is so eye-opening. I really appreciate it. I wish I had all of this information even before my shoot, but I had an amazing photographer, so she at least made me feel super confident and ready and she got great images and it really does change the game and I really appreciate what you're saying and those of you who are listening in. Thank you so much for participating in another episode of the Enough Already podcast and until next time, thanks for listening. Thank you for tuning in. If today's episode lit a fire on you, please rate and review Enough Already on Apple Podcast or subscribe wherever you listen, and if you're looking for your next step, visit me on my website at BetsyJordyn.com and it's Betsy Jordyn with the why, and you'll learn all about our end-to-end services that are custom designed to accelerate your success. Don't wait start today.