0:00:01 - Betsy Jordyn
So if you lost your business mojo I've been there too Want to get it back. Find out how on today's Consulting Matters podcast. And welcome to the Consulting Matters podcast. This is the show for purpose-driven consultants and coaches who are ready to own the power of what they do and position themselves for greater impact and income. I'm your host, betsy Jordyn, and I am an ex-Disney consultant and successful consulting business owner, turned business mentor and brand positioning and messaging strategist. You can find out how I help my clients take the best of their careers and turn it into thriving businesses that they absolutely love on my website at wwwbetsyjordyncom. Don't forget, jordyn is with a Y.
So what are we talking about today? It's all about that moment of what happens to many of us consultants and coaches who've been at it for a while is we've invested a lot of time, money and we built a business that we once loved and all of a sudden we stopped and it's just not working for us anymore. You know, maybe we have clients, but just they're not the right ones or the work we're landing is no longer lighting us up, and you know what happens after that Marketing becomes a dread. So what do you do when this happens, when you still need your business to survive and thrive. What you do is you make a change, and that's exactly what happened to today's guest, pamela Johnson.
So she is a client I have been working with for the last several months, and she was in that exact place where she had a business, it was successful, and then she just fell out of love with it, that she wanted to do something else, and so what she didn't do is double down on what she was doing. You know, she didn't work on some new marketing technique that, all of a sudden, was going to unleash the right clients. She got to work on rebuilding her foundation of her business, which is really getting more clarity on who she wanted to work with now versus what she did in the past. And so once she got that clarity, everything changed. So I could tell you all about her story, because I was in several months working with her behind the scenes in my VIP brand messaging and positioning program, but you're going to enjoy hearing it directly from her and her own experience. So, without further ado, I'm so excited to introduce you to Pamela. So welcome to the show, pamela.
0:02:23 - Pamela Johnson
I'm excited to be here and I appreciate you inviting me, and I can't wait for this conversation.
0:02:30 - Betsy Jordyn
Well, I can't wait for everybody to hear about your story because we've been working on your brand messaging now for I don't know how many months it's been, and I just have loved seeing you know every week. You know you're getting more clarity, but I wanted to help everybody who might've been at the starting point where you're at, to go from the last mojo to the renewed passion. But before we get into what I would call like your last mojo season, can we talk about like just your experience of going from a realtor to a trainer, to a coach, to a coaching business owner, and like just big picture on that journey? Because I know there's a lot of people who are in those different stages where they have a job and then they kind of get into coaching and then they want to have their own business, right.
0:03:11 - Pamela Johnson
Right, ok, well, in a nutshell, I was a trainer in corporate for two different companies and and I loved it, and then I had my daughter and stayed home for a bit and then when you come back from that, people think you've been struck dumb. I don't know why that is, but they do, and so I'm like I'm sure now you're back.
Yes, yes, exactly. So anyway, I couldn't find anything in training, and that was my love. I still love training and it's part of what I do. But so I was looking around. I couldn't even get a temp job, I mean, like it was, it was a weird time. It was a weird time. So what I did was I thought, well, who will take me? Real estate? I've tried real estate, that sounds like fun.
And so I went into real estate. And there were other reasons too. I mean, I do have a passion for homes and I think it just it's like another part of your family. You know your home. So I did have a lot of passion and purpose in that, and I did that for a couple of few years and because of my training, and every time I learned something I would share it with with in the brokerage, like let's, let's get together, and you know, I want to share this with you. And so my training came out. So.
So then I became a team leader and that brought me into more coaching. I miss working with people one-on-one. So then I left that but stayed in the same brokerage and went back into real estate and I had a few people in my brokerage that said, why are you doing that? I said, well, I still want to work with people you know and help them in their businesses. I want to also help people buy homes. So anyway, then a very important person to me in my brokerage and there were a lot of them, um said to me why won't you be a coach? Just go be a coach. And I, I said I don't, I don't even know how that looks Like. How does how do I do that? And so, um, this is the most kismet thing.
A couple of days later, uh, through through some other people, a person I never met called and said um, we're interested in you as a coach for real estate agents and this is how it would work. And it was. It's the was the largest company for real estate coaching, and so I thought, well, now, that was a. I mean, that was I have to, I have to, I have to pursue that. So that ended up going to California and you have to. It's almost an audition. There are a lot of people come and then they choose who, who they would like to um hire, and that's that's what. How it, how it happened. So I was a subcontractor coach within a large company. I traveled a lot because there's a lot of training, traveling to meet your clients, that type of thing, and um, it was good for for a lot of time but um, there was a point of burnout within that, not coaching, but burnout with working as a subcontractor.
0:06:30 - Betsy Jordyn
It's so interesting. What I love about your journey into coaching is it just feels like it was a natural fit, like you had this background of developing people, like I think developing is the word that goes that cuts across like training and coaching, where it's like basically the same. It's like I like to impart knowledge, skills, perspective in somebody else, and training is with a larger group of people. You know, coaching is more one on one and it just seems like that's like a hand in glove fit. It's like you know, some like I think some people like wonder like oh, do you pursue a job in consulting or coaching? It's like no, I think, like the coaching and consulting calling pursues us, you know, and then we just respond. So you responded to it and then it just seems like the universe sort of conspired to say all right, well, here's this amazing opportunity for you to go be a coach full time, and now you're coaching real estate professionals.
So are we up to speed on what you might call your lost mojo season? So it seems like you still love coaching, but you didn't love the context that you were doing coaching. So tell me a little bit more about your lost mojo season and what was going on with you. What were the problems that you were? How did this show up for you? That it was clear to you like I just don't think that I'm doing the right business model, or this is not the right packaging of how I want to do, like, what were those signs? Because I don't. I know for a lot of people, like I lost my mojo, but it's like, what does this look like? Can you like give the indicators that would say, yeah, I've lost my mojo?
0:08:00 - Pamela Johnson
There's two that were glaring and one I was kind of ignoring and then I realized what it was. So one was that I was working again under a certain umbrella and I was losing my voice because I was told how I should coach to such a degree and of course they have the right to do that that I couldn't really bring what I really authentically felt I should bring to clients. So that was, that was a lot, and I had a lot of clients, dozens of clients, at the same time, and that was wearing me out and actually I was becoming sick. I was exhausted. I had no life.
After I hung up the last call, by the way, part of this was when Zoom wasn't there, and then we went to Zoom, but I was very sick and you're kind of like pushing it away, no, I'm just tired right now, etc. And so I know what was happening. Finally, and I thought, I cannot do it like this anymore, I have to have more control over what I do. And I went out on my own, still with real estate agents, but it felt I mean, it was, it felt so much more purposeful. Um, I, I had my voice back, all of that, so that was great, but now, so that's one of the losing my mojo.
0:09:29 - Betsy Jordyn
Wait, hold on. I want to tap into this one before you move on, because it sounds like you had two lost mojo seasons. So one was the season of like I would call that like the subcontractor trap. Yeah, you know where you are, coming under somebody else and you don't have that control over your career and your time and your money and you're doing a lot of work, but you know, as a subcontractor this is all makes sense why you have such a passion. We're going to get to this later for everyone who is listening that one of our passion is for coaches who are stuck in the subcontractor trap. So this seems like where that's where your passion, a lot of your passion, was built. Is like you felt that that frustration very personally?
0:10:08 - Pamela Johnson
Yes, Did I hear that accurately? Yes, absolutely. Yeah, that was. That was a big one.
0:10:13 - Betsy Jordyn
So so then after that, then you moved into the second lost mojo. Time is. The context that brought you and I together is different. It's like you had your own coaching business. You had your voice, you were still working with real estate professionals, but something wasn't working that got us to have our conversation. So what was not working for you in that particular context? And for the real estate professionals who are listening I know you love them and it's not personal about what wasn't working so let's just, like you know, put that out. There is, it's not really personal, but what wasn't working for you in that moment. Well, there.
0:10:49 - Pamela Johnson
I did that for 10 years, so I was coaching real estate agents Well, for over 10 years. If you include the leadership, so it becomes there's. There's nothing for me to learn. At a certain point, I remember one of my clients saying you're the encyclopedia of real estate and there were changes, but I just needed something new. It's really that's a harder one to define because I it was very hard leaving my real estate clients because I did love them, but both of us them and myself, because I did love them, but both of us them and myself were probably feeling Groundhog Day, so that was happening. So, and in the meantime, I'm going into what kind of woke me up into what I'm doing now, if that's OK with you.
0:11:44 - Betsy Jordyn
Yeah, I just I would love to get the context because, like, we could talk all day long about like okay, how did we get into like fixing whatever your messaging issues are, and like that's interesting and all. But what's more interesting, I think, is really the journey from like not having the right mojo, because maybe it wasn't a hundred percent bang on. Like you sounds like you still wanted to be a business owner and you wanted that to be successful, but the packaging of how you were doing it wasn't working anymore. And let's get that established. So we could talk about the process of like figuring out what it is that you really wanted to do.
But like what was? So? It's like, like, what were the signs? Cause I think a lot of people where it's like I don't understand why I don't love this anymore. Like I know I hit that is like as a consultant when I was pivoting from consulting to what I do now.
Like that was so confusing because I had built this career, this network. I'd invested all this money, time, intellectual property, you know all my articles on my blog. It was like why don't I love this anymore? And I think I just want to, um, I don't know, like use your experience to connect with other people around. Like it's like, what is the not loving this anymore? What is that? What are those positive signs for you? And like, how did you take it? As, like you didn't double down, like you continue. You reinvented yourself, like we did all of this work to reinvent yourself. So what was it about those? That moment that you could speak to people who, like take speak to you from your experience, to the people who might be at that same place? Like I don't get it. I've been, I invest a lot of money, time, expertise and why don't I love it anymore?
0:13:14 - Pamela Johnson
Right, so I started paying attention to the messages that were coming to me, and one of them was that I really wanted to work specifically with women, specifically in a certain the midlife era for them, because I'm going through it, right so, and I knew that we could talk about how many listings you have all day long, but you might be dying inside because your energy's not there, because you you're not being taken, you're not, don't have time to take care of yourself, and so that comes for a lot of uh, solopreneurs, right so, womenpreneurs.
So I really just had an affection for them because I was on my own journey of feeling better, of feeling the purpose that I want to fulfill and really defining it. And you really helped me with that because, if you remember, at the beginning it was not as specific and you asked me so who are the people that come to you and ask you for advice? And I knew immediately other coaches and I had been coaching some coaches and I loved it and we were in the same lane, we had the same struggles and we have now a lot more answers to it, and so to have a thriving business and have a quality of life is where I, that's where I live in coaching. That's that's. That's what I want to do to help other women, because I there's always going to be struggles, but I am so much better than I was at at that earlier time.
0:15:08 - Betsy Jordyn
I think what I love about. There's so many things I love about what you're talking about here. You know one is really the secret to sustainable success is you do need a business that grows with you. And it's like maybe back in the day, a younger version of Pamela was all into like let's talk about real estate and listings and coach you on the business side. And then, as you grew through your own midlife journey, you started being more interested in other conversations and other people were more interested in those conversations as it relates to you and your business. It sounds like you're just your business wasn't keeping up with how, with how you were evolving.
0:15:40 - Pamela Johnson
Right, yes, yes, that would be, that would be true. And so my messaging was wrong. I was all word of mouth, you know it was. There was a lot of, there was so much that I could do, that I was realizing especially I don't want to keep bringing this in, but especially listening to you and you know what could, could, could be, and so, um, yeah, that just opened a whole new world and that's that's the I, I, I mean I like pivoted, and part of it was the idea. And, um, I saw it even before you went on sabbatical.
I uh had a colleague who goes on sabbatical for one month every year and she said she has had more business, more production than ever by doing that, by just getting out of it. She gets out of the country and enjoying her family and no phone. And, and guess what? She people, she still has clients, no phone. And guess what? She still has clients. They'll wait for her, they'll literally wait for her. So that was a message. And then, right after that, I saw that you were going on sabbatical. I was just ready to come on, betsy, let's work together. And we'd never spoken and I just waited till after your sabbatical.
0:17:02 - Betsy Jordyn
I'm so appreciative. You waited because my sabbatical was supposed to be four months and it turned out to be seven, and I can't believe you waited all seven months for me. So thank you, that means so much to me. I think you're clarifying something for me, because there's, you know, part of where I get really animated like I always get animated with my clients, like on best practices for sure, like things that I've learned for, like I've been in business now for over 15 years, which is kind of crazy. But the thing I get most animated around is like the mistakes that I've made. And one of the things that is like becomes my hobby horse is like you have to brand your business with your name. I'm like anybody who works with me. It's like do your name because, like, my fictitious names are really painful.
And I think you're really clarifying why I always say it's like you want to have a container that like grows as you grow. But I think what you're really clarifying is, in order to sustain a solopreneur, consulting or coaching business, where you are the product, you're in the brand, it has to grow with you. Otherwise you're going to get stuck, and I think it's really about like it's like I'm visualizing is like you were growing, your messaging was here. So it's like I want to be here, but my messaging is here and it's like it's like a little tether, like kind of hooked to the back of a car, and it's like I want to move forward but your messaging and everything was holding you back. And that's where it's like I've got to get this fixed, because I know my car wants to go faster, better, in a different direction.
But everything that I've done to date and how I'm setting it up, you know, is that what got you here won't get you there, but it's like what got you here, you know, and trust is like learning how to detach that, and I think that's a big part of the work that we did together was was letting that go. So let's get into um anyway. Well, so while I just find this fascinating that you waited for me on sabbatical, is there other things that you tried in the interim? Like cause, I know a lot of people when they're in the in-between time, like I think one people do when they're in the lost mojo phase, is they double down on what they used to do but making like somehow, magically, they're going to love it again. What are other things that you might've tried to fix the lost mojo before we started working together.
0:19:04 - Pamela Johnson
Well trying to I don't know make, make um, my mindset work with me, to to keep having the clients that I have and then feel more purposeful. It was you that I was waiting for, Um, and, and I still had. I still was coaching during that time, but especially after we started working together. That's why I had to wait, because I needed a partner and I needed a really direct sounding board for what I'm doing, because what we're doing now, that wasn't fully formed at all in my head until we worked together. And then you really just kind of pushed back on some things and said, well, you know, here's where I see you. And that really helped. And then even with our branding too, I was like, no, I think I want it this way. And you said, look at it again, look at it again. And now we oh, I love what's going on right now with our branding.
0:20:13 - Betsy Jordyn
I can't wait to talk about the visual branding. There's so many things I would love to continue to talk to you Like. Okay, so let's save on the visual branding, cause I want to talk a little bit, like once we got the clarity and how we got to the certain icons. But your visual branding, I swear, is like one of my favorite things. My client, my team, is produced.
So I'm just curious on something like like why, in the age of AI, like so many people like chat GPT their way, try to chat GPT their way through brand messaging and clarity and stuff like that, why was that type of thing not sufficient and why did you wait for, like, why did you wait? Like I am curious why you waited for me. You know versus. You know you could have gone to another branding agency. You could have DIY your way with chat GPT. You know why did you wait? I'm sure you've done ideal client. I know you have Amy Porterfield's class, like I'm sure you did the ideal client avatar exercises that she had. Why did you wait for me? I think it was.
0:21:07 - Pamela Johnson
Well, I saw some of your podcasts. Of course, I think, for for who I did look at, you were definitely the most qualified to talk to me about branding. That's that I, I I felt that I've never had to think, think about this before, but, um, you know, there's some times where you're just like that's going to be, that's that's the person that I want to work with, um, and I, I definitely I remember thinking you went on sabbatical and I thought I really hope she's coming back. What am I going to do? Because I didn't want it to start birching again. Yeah, and I don't, I can't, I can't remember what the first contact I had with you meaning me seeing you and I think it might've been an email or something that I was searching for. I don't know, and I wish I did so I could tell you, but I just I think it's really just intuition.
0:22:10 - Betsy Jordyn
So why don't you chat to your way through it? A lot of people are thinking you know, when it comes to brand messaging and clarity, it's like, oh, I don't need to hire somebody like Betsy, I could just chat GPT my way through it. Why is that not a good answer from your perspective?
0:22:24 - Pamela Johnson
Well, first of all, I'm into AI, I love it, I do consult it. I ask it to prompt me, to give me some ideas of what to write, that type of things. But I think that that's part of a patchwork. So I know that a lot of people say, well, I'll get somebody maybe in Fiverr and they'll do a logo and then the messaging maybe I'll get a copyright person. And I mean, I've been through all of that as well a while ago and I watched my clients. I watched my clients try to patchwork, to try to save money and time, patchwork it together and eventually either they get pro program that actually works so many, so many, so much lost money and time doing that.
Um, so it's the linear path for the, for the entire branding and setting up and launching, and that was that. I don't know where I would see that anywhere else, specifically for coaching and consulting. I I know of some folks and I've I've dabbled with them and see that's what it was. You dabble here, you dabble there and you're trying, you, you trying to put it all together. And this is something that I did for other people, but for yourself, you kind of need a partner to just go alongside. That really is in your corner and will help you get the best result.
0:24:05 - Betsy Jordyn
I love that you said that, because that is something that I think I've been evolving into and I think when I made this shift like I got rid of my fictitious names and I just decided I'm Betsy Jordyn International, like that's like whatever my LLC is and I just go by, you know is when I was like I'm not really training consultants and coaches on, like my OD best practices. I'm really leaning into the brand messaging Like that's my, that's my sweet spot. Everybody wants this for me. Like no matter what I offer, like even my impact and income accelerator, like anybody who signs up, even the people who signed up for that, they still wanted my brand messaging Like accelerator. Like anybody who signs up, even the people who signed up for that, they still wanted my brand messaging Like it still goes back down to that. So it's like I didn't know that that's like the bread and butter.
But what I started to notice is I'd go through all the effort with the brand messaging and then they go to somebody else to help with, like the visual branding and then somebody else has like some one of those surface level like ideal client thing and you know messaging and like, and then the whole thing falls apart and it's like, okay, now we're done, you know, so, like all that work led to nothing, you know. Or we did the same thing where they went and tried to work on their copy and all that went to nothing, you know, and it's like, oh, I need to, like, take them all the way through to the business foundation, so it's consistent. But my container allowed that and I think that that was a lot of the perspective that I think, maybe subconsciously, I did that you want to do for your clients.
0:25:32 - Pamela Johnson
Absolutely.
0:25:32 - Betsy Jordyn
So I think that there could have been a resonance of, like I'm doing something for my clients that you want to do for yours, because you want to be that person who really guides these women, not just and I think this is where, like, let's get into the process of how you got to the clarity. But I think the shift was you wanted to work with coaches and then we narrowed it down to women coaches and then there was a little bit more like women coaches that were in the subcontracting trap and helping them move into this other place. Like, how did you get to more of that refined clarity for yourself? Like, what was it about the process that helped you? Like, ah, you know, I want to do this is who my ideal client is.
0:26:13 - Pamela Johnson
First, um, what you did with me and what I'm doing, um, too, is to figure out who I am, um, bring out in me. What are, what are the expertise, the wisdom, the skills, what, what do you? What do we have here? Because a lot of people don't acknowledge to themselves what they do great or what their gifts are, but they'll think about everything that they don't have going on right. So that was a great exercise. So we dug into well, who am I? What do I really want? What, what is, what is the purpose that I want to bring to all of this? And start there and then match up women coaches. And that was all from the exercises that we went through, the writing we went through to figure that all out, and that was so eye-opening and helpful. I didn't even expect that that's where we were going to start, but it was the perfect place because then it was a foundation for everything else we were going to do.
0:27:30 - Betsy Jordyn
I think that what I love about the process, too, is like there was a couple other things that you'd identified. It's like they're not just women coaches, business owners are stuck in the subcontractor trap. But you also identified some of their attributes Like they are like achievement type, achievement oriented. They're not just like, they're not just somebody who is like I just care about my clients and they're not willing to do something. It's like they're achievement oriented, they want to go forward and build something of their own, but they just hate marketing, you know. And it's like solving some of the marketing and mindset challenges, which is a little different than like not exactly what I do, but still kind of like. In that vein of like there's a bigger problem, like their mindset of what it is, and so I think that that really created, you know, a certain level of differentiation.
And then I saw like you had this compassion for them, like OK, let's move. Like I want them to have a business that's thriving, that that's their own, that helps them be you know, the person that they want to be, not just the business owner. And I think once you saw that like okay, now I'm moving. Like it solved your mojo problem. You know, like, and why do you? Why would that? Why do you think like getting clarity on this person would solve a mojo problem? Cause you were still coaching? You know like a lot of people think like, oh, I love coaching. You know like, so like switching it from a real estate person to this person how did that really start to solve the mojo problem?
0:28:56 - Pamela Johnson
It was, you know, when we came to the point where it's, because at the beginning we said solopreneurs and you said that's a big why, right, so meaning, why would you want to? And that wasn't very clear. And then you said who, who, who comes to you? And it was coaches. And then it was it. It just was internal, just like that's it, like that's who I, I have coach coaches and I look forward to those calls and I, you know so, those calls, and I, you know so, and I know what, what, what they're struggling with.
I know I've been there. I've been there, I have overcome, I have made all the mistakes, I have made the patchwork mistake, I've done all those things and now I know what works for, uh, as being a coach. And there's so many people that these high achieving women that have been in corporate or they've been subcontract coaches or they've never really gotten their coaching business off the ground, but they, but they really have something to give and so that's, I mean, that's just like opening the door for somebody to get them what they want in their life and have a really meaningful occupation at.
0:30:14 - Betsy Jordyn
You know, in the end, You're you're tapping into like a really big secret, I think, to identifying your ideal client, specifically for coaches, even if you're working in an organization or as a specific, especially if you have you're working with private clients, and that is your ideal client is usually a younger version of you, like we could spend all day long Like I know a lot of coaches think like I could help anybody who needs a coach and it's like, yeah, but not everybody who needs a coach needs you, you know, like they need somebody who's more specific and I think that that's where, like our passion, like we're sparked to compassion and action, is usually because that person is mirroring something in our story.
And and I think that that's where it's like it's there's one thing to see it, another thing to trust it, and I wonder if that's just the role that I was playing is like oh no, no, that makes sense. Like that's different, you know, like was it that you cause? You might've seen it before, but it was it like help, like the conversation of having somebody outside of you hold up the mirror and say, oh yeah, that makes sense, and now I trust it.
0:31:12 - Pamela Johnson
Yes, and, if I'm really honest about it, I thought, well, can I do that? And I know all the things right, but I still have that thing like, really Me, is that what I should be doing? You know, is that for me Excitingly? But, um, also I'm hesitating on it because I'm changing my whole business. Um, so that was that was part of getting through it and knowing that, yes, absolutely, um, that that I am the one to help women that have already been through a career, probably their second or third career. They want to be, they want to go into coaching, and they hate the idea of putting themselves out there. Because, when, when?
I think a lot of times coaching is so attractive because, oh, I can be behind the scenes helping people, but that's not the world we live in anymore, and so we might as well be loud and proud. And so and I struggle with that, I mean even even this podcast you said you, you asked me a week ago or so and you said you know, would you want to do this? And I said yes, but inside I thought, oh, no. And so I thought, well, this is part of it. Right, to get out there. I'm glad I did, but that's the part that coaches. A lot of them have that heart where it's like no, it's okay, I'll be over here and you do all the big things, but that's part of it. And so helping people to create authentic to them marketing, authentic social media platforms if that's what they choose. So looking at what their personality is, what they see, and helping them be very specific and very customized for what they can do and want to do. So that's that's, that's the idea.
0:33:15 - Betsy Jordyn
But the reality is like this, like this is the hard thing when it comes to consultants and coaches, who are the personal brand. I don't think it's just like we hate marketing. I think we hate the visibility that marketing requires of us. So in no other profession outside of ours not even like therapists, like they could hide behind, like somebody needs to go to someone for anxiety, like there's like a technical need, you know, like we're optional and and it's all connected to us and in order for us to get clients, like we have to show up in a visibility standpoint and we have to be seen. And then, by the way, we have to like figure out how to do all of these things in front of an audience. Like it's super vulnerable and what, what I feel like is the antidote to this, and I think this is what we worked on.
So tell me I don't want to put words in your mouth, but I think what the antidote where you're like we're questioning it is when your vision for who you want to help gets bigger, the fear gets smaller, because it's like, well, I got to do something in order to reach them, because I really want to find them, you know, and I want to. I want to make it easy for them to find me. So if I'm like, if I'm going to be all hiding, they're never going to find me. So it's making that vision bigger and I think that's why, like, we haven't even gotten to the other parts of the brand messaging we're just still talking about, like how you got clarity in your ideal client, but we haven't even gotten to like what you do, how you're different, but I don't even know if that's as important as like this is who I want, to what I'm made for.
0:34:38 - Pamela Johnson
Then it's easier to put yourself out there because you have people to help to get them on their track. So it really does take the focus off of myself and knowing that I am the one that can help, because there's a lot of people out there that call themselves coaches and all of the things. When you have a purpose and you know exactly who you want to serve, it changes how you feel about the marketing and we worked on your title.
0:35:22 - Betsy Jordyn
I wonder if you have it off the top of your mind of what your title is and how you came, came up with your title. Um, title in like, what kind of like we think it was, like it wasn't. Oh, my business. My title yes.
0:35:36 - Pamela Johnson
Oh yeah, Business development strategist.
0:35:42 - Betsy Jordyn
So why was the word strategist important to you and how did that? How did that showcase a differentiation for you in comparison to other business coaches?
0:36:03 - Pamela Johnson
To me, strategy is looking at what's the challenge. Who are we working with and designing a plan especially for them. So a strategist isn't just a, a program that you know is recorded and everybody goes through it. To me, that's not a strategy. I mean there would be strategies within, but that's how I look at strategists. As strategy, that I'm looking at. What do you want to accomplish? What type of coach do you want to be? What, what, what is your messaging going to be? What is your marketing going to be? How are we going to get you out there? And every single person that I ask that will have a different strategy. That's how I see it.
0:36:46 - Betsy Jordyn
So you're going more personalized. I think that that is an interesting differentiator in today's market too is if we're in a world of, like you know, lots of people were buying digital. Everybody was going to the one to many you know the courses and the programs.
Now we have AI and I think that is a really key way that consultants and coaches can stand out is when everybody's going in this way, like I'm going this way, like I, like you're all doing group coaching programs, like I'm doing. You know, I'm focusing on the one, on one personalized, bespoke kind of thing, and it sounds like you're kind of on that same same standpoint. And you know, and I think personally, you could probably give those women coaches better results than if they just signed up for a program, like they can sign up for really great programs. Like you know, Marie Forleo's B-School is a great program, but it's not personalized to her unique situation and I think that's where you can provide something very different.
Yes, it's like you can listen into what you want for your career, what you want in your life. How do you tailor it? What marketing strategies will make you want to die and you won't want to do them, and which ones, like I could try them out, you know and you could help. You could help them with that.
0:37:46 - Pamela Johnson
Yes, yes, absolutely. And I've seen all the the types of right marketing and I know it's not going to be for everybody. So that is exactly what I want to do is help them through that part so that they can have the business that they want.
0:38:06 - Betsy Jordyn
So you've gotten past the point where now you've made it through the foundational brand messaging, so you've got clarity on who you help, what you do, how you're different, the unique value that your clients get from working with you. How does getting to that level of clarity and that foundational messaging help you with the other stuff? So we're working now on your visual branding, which I definitely want you to speak to about what are the elements and how. That gave you clarity. And then you're also working on your website copy. So you're not 100% done, you're in process. But how does this help you from where you are now, where you might've been stuck?
0:38:37 - Pamela Johnson
before, when, when. For me, when I find have branding this is the first time, by the way, it's been this good but when I've have branding that I can be excited about, that represents who I really am um, just just the visuals branding, right. So it means something. To me that was a thing that we've talked about a little bit as well is like what would the logo be and why would that mean anything for you? And we really hit it on the nail.
0:39:11 - Betsy Jordyn
Let's back up because I want to be more specific, because I can't wait for your visual branding to come out. So I'm selfish on this one because I love this one so much. So we got clarity on around, like, these women, they're beautiful, they're thriving as women business owners. So, like, how did that give you direction to what you wound up with your icon, which was a dragonfly, and then we got more refinement with a dragonfly with a bunch of mosaics in the wings. How did the brand messaging help you get clarity even on that as your icon? And what does that icon represent to you?
0:39:46 - Pamela Johnson
So I've always loved dragonflies. I like them in art. I like them flying around my yard. They seem to be a little magical, and so you asked me like what would be something? Well, I, I liked, I like poppies, like a one poppy, and we talked about that a little bit, and we talked about um Santa Fe artist uh, georgia O'Keeffe.
0:40:14 - Betsy Jordyn
Okay.
0:40:15 - Pamela Johnson
And you said I don't see that. And so that was the first thing that came up for me and he said I don't know about the poppy, but let's, what else, what else? And so I said, well, I love dragonflies, but I don't know how I could incorporate that. And so we looked it up when we were on a zoom and we searched what does dragon fly mean? And dragon flies, they mean transformation. They mean the reason why is because they're born in the water and then they get their wings and they fly and so and they go through a huge transformation in their life cycle and they also I know that some Native American groups look at them as if they are spirits from past ones, and these, you know, it just was a very rich. It signified for different people, very rich. But I love the idea of the transformation and that you're in water and you have to struggle and then you become that dragonfly and fly, and so that meant a lot to me. So we we started with that and then we went into dragonfly world and looking at what would it be, what would it look like? And then, um, I liked one of the designs.
Actually, I kind of did a little bit more on my own. And then you said, but look at this, I think it was B or something. You look at B, I love B. And I said, well, I don't know that I wanted to be so girly. And then but, but then we looked at it again and then you put some more colors in it and it was it. It was so beautiful.
And one of the things that I have the freedom of is I'm working with women and I can be all the girly I want to. You know, and I've always kind of hesitated because I had a lot of male um clients I've been with that's what I was used to women and men, and I didn't want the men to feel like, you know, they're not in the right place. But my place is different now, and so I that it just, it just gelled the whole thing, and then it better and better and better, as your people uh, worked on it and I I just had a peek at some of the, the resources that are going to be branded this morning, and I was like this is so good.
0:42:46 - Betsy Jordyn
So yeah, I'm pretty excited about it and the color palette is bang on, and I think that there's something about like, kind of going with intuition too. It's like, like I like my belief around your business is the right business. Like, the reason why you hit the like, you've lost the mojo is that that business is no longer in alignment with your strengths, your experiences, your passion. Like, like, you've outgrown that one. That's the same reason, like, like, and I think the expectation that we're not going to lose our mojo at different phases is unrealistic, because that was always a sign when you were in business like, okay, it's time for a promotion or a new job, Like you can't keep doing the same same thing every year.
You gotta like, you gotta push yourself, and I think that, um, but the secret is is that you want to be able to align it, and I think when we were doing solopreneur, it was like it's too vague, you know like it's not really connecting and it's not an alignment with your passion, it's not alignment with your story. You know like, and your story goes deeper, we're not going to get into that on on this call, but it's like how important economic empowerment is for women.
And it's like, but when you align it, everything makes sense, you know. And so, even if you have like a long-term passion with a dragonfly, like well, that makes sense and I love that. Like I have the butterfly, the butterfly is a very different transformation story which fits a little bit more like with more of my passion is around, like their transform. I like the dragonflies transformation story. I wish mine was more like the dragonfly, where I was just in water and all of a sudden I grew wings, instead of being in a cocoon where you like die to yourself. You know, I like, I like that one better, but you know, oh well, but I think that it still goes back to the alignment piece and I think when you're in alignment, you choose marketing things that don't suck, that you actually could enjoy Like I'm technically I'm doing marketing right now, but am I like I'm having a conversation with somebody I really enjoy talking to, like that's the difference.
And when you're, when you start really growing this business, I think that's going to be the same. I think there's another benefit to when we talk through your products and services around having like people of other things that you want to do, so it's like you want to do the one-on-one coaching, but this, this business model, has given you flexibility for the other pieces of your business that you want to create. Can you speak to a little bit more to some of the other ways that you want to serve your clients, to leverage more of your training skills?
0:44:55 - Pamela Johnson
Yes. So, um, in my, when I was a uh coach for real estate agents, I would have a annual um retreat and they were we, just it was very good, it was, um, it was what people kind of waited for, right, they would ask me like, tell me, because I have to put it on my calendar, right. So I and I enjoy doing them because it did bring back my training. It was a workshop kind of, you know, and I facilitated it very small retreats and including well-being in your business, well-being in your soul, well-being in your just your physical well-being, right.
So, and because I think, especially the, the clients that are the clients that are my ideal clients, they are, they call it the sandwich era of life. So you may, you may have grown children who are now now giving you grandchildren, which is great, and your parents may be elderly and need help, and you become, you come, it feels like you become a resource for everybody else, right, so, really putting the focus on how you are doing, because without you, that that everybody is going to, it's going to be worse. So, and I don't, I think we're just used to, I think the younger generation is onto it, I hope so that we have to put ourselves first to to help the family, to help, you know, for your business, et cetera. So that just digging in and just really what they want in their life, what they want to accomplish, how they want to show up as mom, wife, grandma, whatever, and making sure that they have time for themselves, time to enjoy, not just to sleep, because that's the usual.
0:47:14 - Betsy Jordyn
Just want to sleep, not just to sleep, because that's the usual, just want to sleep.
I feel like what I'm like, as I'm hearing into what you're talking about, like when I think about all of the different things that you offer is that you provide like holistic strategy to financial and life abundance, like it's like it's not about like even success or thriving, but you want to get people, like with wellsprings of abundance you know, in in their energy and they're in like this wellspring, like that's kind of like the image which kind of makes sense, like a wellspring with the water, you know, and the you know, and the dragonfly, but I think that that that would that could be language that you can play around with too.
It's like like. It's like you don't want just a business that's profitable. You don't want just a business that's profitable. You don't want just a business and a life that you love. You don't want just a business that is successful over the long term. You want a business that delivers your total life abundance from the inside out, like with your energy or your time, your everything, so that you could be whatever you need to be to whoever you need to be in your life.
Like.
0:48:13 - Pamela Johnson
That's the unique value of working with you Absolutely, absolutely, rest and renewal.
0:48:18 - Betsy Jordyn
Thankfully, this is recording while you're still working on your website copy, so you know we could play around with that. So, speaking of your website, that is still under construction. How can people connect with you? So if you're a woman coach or who's deaf, if you're a woman coach, who's in your in coaching as your second or third career, you're stuck in the subcontractor trap and you're you want more of a holistic support from somebody who gets the business side and the personal side.
0:48:45 - Pamela Johnson
You need to talk to Pamela and you can reach out to Pamela where PamelaJohnsonCoachingcom and just click on on have a discovery call and we'll have a complimentary call and see if we're fit to maybe work together even in the future.
0:49:04 - Betsy Jordyn
Now, but yeah, that's where we're going to start is just having a conversation so, and if you're listening now in in november of 2025, you know the website will not be the updated version. If they're coming and you're listening to this episode in 2020 early, you know, after Q1 of 2026, the website will be updated with the dragonfly, so don't go over there looking for the dragonfly.
0:49:29 - Pamela Johnson
You're not going to find it, not yet, and also on LinkedIn.
0:49:33 - Betsy Jordyn
can people get ahold of you on LinkedIn?
0:49:35 - Pamela Johnson
Yes, I'm on LinkedIn as well.
0:49:37 - Betsy Jordyn
And I'm sure there's a thousand Pamela Johnsons.
0:49:39 - Pamela Johnson
There's a thousand Pamela's.
0:49:40 - Betsy Jordyn
I guess I'll just put it. I'll put it in the show notes, but is there, like you know. But is there? Is there anything with your name that would like make you stand out, At least with Betsy Jordyn? I'm the only one, Except for the Betsy Jordyn with the A, that's another one.
0:49:54 - Pamela Johnson
I think I'm Pamela D Johnson in LinkedIn.
0:49:59 - Betsy Jordyn
So is there anything else that you want to tell me about how you got your business mojo back, or what it meant to you to work through your brand positioning, building this business that you love? About your coaching practice and what you're excited about building? Anything about being clear and confident, anything that relates to this whole topic? And I'm just not asking you the right question. Are you experienced with working with me? And I didn't ask you the right question.
0:50:25 - Pamela Johnson
I knew you were going to ask me this. Oh cause I do it at the end of all my podcasts.
0:50:33 - Betsy Jordyn
That's my famous wrap up. I don't have the fun one like if you were going to be, you know, going to the pearly gates, what would you say? Or what's your favorite swear word? I could have done something like that, but this is my signature the thing that comes to me is that everybody has a story.
0:50:54 - Pamela Johnson
I don't know if it. I used to watch Good Morning America not Good Morning America, excuse me CBS, Sunday Morning CBS, and there was a piece in there and it was everybody has a story, and I'll get to the point. So this gentleman his last name is Hart A-H-A-R-T, and he would go to the map of the United States and throw a dart and wherever that dart landed, he would go to that town, go to this is how long ago to a phone book, and would just do this to the phone book and put his finger down and he would call that person and they would. He would say I'm with CBS and I want to do your story. And every single person said you don't want to do a story about me, there's nothing special about me, I'm boring. There's I, you, you should probably have somebody else do it. And he usually gets them to agree and every single time they'll.
They'll start with I don't know why you're here in my living room because I really don't have a story and then something will finally reveal itself in their conversation. For instance, one was that these couple, this older couple, over the years had fostered over 40 children, and all the pictures were on the wall, and so so everybody has a story, and so I, I've always kept that idea, that, and and even ourselves right, we have a story that's worth telling. We have a story to that that's worth growing in your business, in your life, and that's worth growing in your business, in your life, and people like you and people like me can help you pull out that story for who you really are and what's so extraordinary about you. And so that's that's what comes to my mind, that, um, I would love to keep getting that message out that everybody, every person, has a story.
0:52:58 - Betsy Jordyn
Wow, that's beautiful. That was a perfect way to end this episode, because I think that that is maybe the hack of the successful business getting your mojo back. Whatever that is is like really just appreciate on your story and that there's meaning in that story and that paying your story forward is how you're going to actually make the impact that you really want to make as a consultant or coach. Like, honestly, that's like the secret. Well, you know, I could talk to you forever because that's how our sessions go, so I can't wait for the rest of your business to come to life. So you know, we'll have to stay tuned For those who are listening.
If you want to work on your brand messaging and positioning or need the one-stop shop like Pamela was talking about, I'd love to work with you. Head on over to my website at wwwbetsyjordyncom forward slash services or, better yet, you can just hit that big pink button at the top of my website and you can book a call with me and we can talk about more, about a custom solution for you, because I'm all about customization, just like Pamela and I were discussing. So also, don't forget to hit subscribe wherever you're listening If you want to continue to get actual inspiration on growing a high impact, high profit business. And I guess that's it until next time. Thanks so much for listening.
